Paul Haggis| Paul Haggis Resigns from Church of Scientology | | Print | |
| Friday, 23 October 2009 22:57 | ||||||
 Paul Haggis is the Academy award winning filmmaker who, in 2006, became the first screenwriter, since 1950, to write two Best Film Oscar winners back-to-back – “Million Dollar Baby” (2004) directed by Clint Eastwood, and “Crash” (2005) which he himself directed. For “Crash,” he won Academy Awards for Best Picture and Best Original Screenplay. The film also received an additional four nominations including one for Haggis’ direction. “Crash” reaped numerous awards during its year of release from associations such as the IFP Spirit Awards, the Screen Actors Guild, and BAFTA. In 2006, Haggis’ screenplay collaborations included the duo Clint Eastwood productions “Flags of our Fathers” and “Letters from Iwo Jima,” the latter earning him his third screenplay Oscar nomination. He also helped pen “Casino Royale,” which garnered considerable acclaim for reinvigorating the James Bond spy franchise and has written the screenplay for the next Bond production “Quantum of Solace.” Haggis’ directorial follow-up to “Crash” was “In the Valley of Elah” which he wrote, directed, and produced, for Warner Independent Pictures. The film, which starred Tommy Lee Jones, Charlize Theron and Susan Sarandon, was a suspense drama of a father’s search for his missing son, who is reported AWOL after returning from Iraq. Jones earned a Best Actor Oscar nomination for his performance in the film. Most recently, Haggis and his partner Michael Nozik formed Hwy 61 Films, based at United Artists. Their first venture is an adaptation of the celebrated Australian novel “The Ranger’s Apprentice.” Haggis was born in London, Ontario, Canada and moved to California in his early 20s. For over two decades he has written, directed and produced television shows such as “thirtysomething” and “The Tracey Ullman Show,” and also developed credits as a pup writer on many Norman Lear sitcoms. He created the acclaimed, if short-lived, CBS series “EZ Streets” which the New York Times cited as one of the most influential shows of all time, noting, that without it “there would be no Sopranos.” Haggis is equally committed to his private and social concerns. He is co-founder of Artists for Peace and Justice, a working board member of EMA (The Environmental Media Association) as well as the advocacy group Office Of The Americas, among others. He is married, the father of four children, and splits his time between residences in Los Angeles and New York. -- from IMDb Mini Biography by: zkozlowski Paul Haggis' Letter to Miscavige Mouthpiece, Tommy Davis Tommy, As you know, for ten months now I have been writing to ask you to make a public statement denouncing the actions of the Church of Scientology of San Diego. Their public sponsorship of Proposition 8, a hate-filled legislation that succeeded in taking away the civil rights of gay and lesbian citizens of California – rights that were granted them by the Supreme Court of our state – shames us. I called and wrote and implored you, as the official spokesman of the church, to condemn their actions. I told you I could not, in good conscience, be a member of an organization where gay-bashing was tolerated. In that first conversation, back at the end of October of last year, you told me you were horrified, that you would get to the bottom of it and “heads would roll.” You promised action. Ten months passed. No action was forthcoming. The best you offered was a weak and carefully worded press release, which praised the church’s human rights record and took no responsibility. Even that, you decided not to publish. The church’s refusal to denounce the actions of these bigots, hypocrites and homophobes is cowardly. I can think of no other word. Silence is consent, Tommy. I refuse to consent. I joined the Church of Scientology thirty-five years ago. During my twenties and early thirties I studied and received a great deal of counseling. While I have not been an active member for many years, I found much of what I learned to be very helpful, and I still apply it in my daily life. I have never pretended to be the best Scientologist, but I openly and vigorously defended the church whenever it was criticized, as I railed against the kind of intolerance that I believed was directed against it. I had my disagreements, but I dealt with them internally. I saw the organization – with all its warts, growing pains and problems – as an underdog. And I have always had a thing for underdogs. But I reached a point several weeks ago where I no longer knew what to think. You had allowed our name to be allied with the worst elements of the Christian Right. In order to contain a potential “PR flap” you allowed our sponsorship of Proposition 8 to stand. Despite all the church’s words about promoting freedom and human rights, its name is now in the public record alongside those who promote bigotry and intolerance, homophobia and fear. The fact that the Mormon Church drew all the fire, that no one noticed, doesn’t matter. I noticed. And I felt sick. I wondered how the church could, in good conscience, through the action of a few and then the inaction of its leadership, support a bill that strips a group of its civil rights. This was my state of mind when I was online doing research and chanced upon an interview clip with you on CNN. The interview lasted maybe ten minutes – it was just you and the newscaster. And in it I saw you deny the church’s policy of disconnection. You said straight-out there was no such policy, that it did not exist. I was shocked. We all know this policy exists. I didn’t have to search for verification – I didn’t have to look any further than my own home. You might recall that my wife was ordered to disconnect from her parents because of something absolutely trivial they supposedly did twenty-five years ago when they resigned from the church. This is a lovely retired couple, never said a negative word about Scientology to me or anyone else I know – hardly raving maniacs or enemies of the church. In fact it was they who introduced my wife to Scientology. Although it caused her terrible personal pain, my wife broke off all contact with them. I refused to do so. I’ve never been good at following orders, especially when I find them morally reprehensible. For a year and a half, despite her protestations, my wife did not speak to her parents and they had limited access to their grandchild. It was a terrible time. That’s not ancient history, Tommy. It was a year ago. And you could laugh at the question as if it was a joke? You could publicly state that it doesn’t exist? To see you lie so easily, I am afraid I had to ask myself: what else are you lying about? And that is when I read the recent articles in the St. Petersburg Times. They left me dumbstruck and horrified. These were not the claims made by “outsiders” looking to dig up dirt against us. These accusations were made by top international executives who had devoted most of their lives to the church. Say what you will about them now, these were staunch defenders of the church, including Mike Rinder, the church’s official spokesman for 20 years! Tommy, if only a fraction of these accusations are true, we are talking about serious, indefensible human and civil rights violations. It is still hard for me to believe. But given how many former top-level executives have said these things are true, it is hard to believe it is all lies.
And when I pictured you assuring me that it is all lies, that this is nothing but an unfounded and vicious attack by a group of disgruntled employees, I am afraid that I saw the same face that looked in the camera and denied the policy of disconnection. I heard the same voice that professed outrage at our support of Proposition 8, who promised to correct it, and did nothing. I carefully read all of your rebuttals, I watched every video where you presented the church’s position, I listened to all your arguments – ever word. I wish I could tell you that they rang true. But they didn’t. I was left feeling outraged, and frankly, more than a little stupid. And though it may seem small by comparison, I was truly disturbed to see you provide private details from confessionals to the press in an attempt to embarrass and discredit the executives who spoke out. A priest would go to jail before revealing secrets from the confessional, no matter what the cost to himself or his church. That’s the kind of integrity I thought we had, but obviously the standard in this church is far lower – the public relations representative can reveal secrets to the press if the management feels justified. You even felt free to publish secrets from the confessional in Freedom Magazine – you just stopped short of labeling them as such, probably because you knew Scientologists would be horrified, knowing you so easily broke a sacred vow of trust with your parishioners. How dare you use private information in order to label someone an “adulteress?” You took Amy Scobee’s most intimate admissions about her sexual life and passed them onto the press and then smeared them all over the pages your newsletter! I do not know the woman, but no matter what she said or did, this is the woman who joined the Sea Org at 16! She ran the entire celebrity center network, and was a loyal senior executive of the church for what, 20 years? You want to rebut her accusations, do it, and do it in the strongest terms possible – but that kind of character assassination is unconscionable. So, I am now painfully aware that you might see this an attack and just as easily use things I have confessed over the years to smear my name. Well, luckily I have never held myself up to be anyone’s role model. The great majority of Scientologists I know are good people who are genuinely interested in improving conditions on this planet and helping others. I have to believe that if they knew what I now know, they too would be horrified. But I know how easy it was for me to defend our organization and dismiss our critics, without ever truly looking at what was being said; I did it for thirty-five years. And so, after writing this letter, I am fully aware that some of my friends may choose to no longer associate with me, or in some cases work with me. I will always take their calls, as I always took yours. However, I have finally come to the conclusion that I can no longer be a part of this group. Frankly, I had to look no further than your refusal to denounce the church’s anti-gay stance, and the indefensible actions, and inactions, of those who condone this behavior within the organization. I am only ashamed that I waited this many months to act. I hereby resign my membership in the Church of Scientology. Sincerely, Paul Haggis Ps. I’ve attached our email correspondence. At some point it became evident that you did not value my concerns about the church’s tacit support of an amendment that violated the civil rights of so many of our citizens. Perhaps if you had done a little more research on me, the church’s senior management wouldn’t have dismissed those concerns quite so cavalierly. While I am no great believer in resumes and awards, this is what you would have discovered: * Founder, Artists For Peace and Justice, Awards for outspoken support of Civil and Human Rights: * Valentine Davies Award – Writers Guild of America And many dozens of fundraisers and salons at our home on behalf of Human and Civil Rights, the Environment, the Peace Movement, Education, Justice and Equality.
This letter was published online by Marty Rathbun on his blog after he received a copy from a third party recipient of the letter. After verifying it's authenticity with his source, Marty decided to publish it so that the import of the issues it covers are fully aired and considered by readers. Marty hopes that the author of the letter will understand that by publishing the letter we mean no disrespect. Quite the contrary, it is our level of respect for the author’s life work and integrity that makes us confident many people will benefit from the author’s example, others will feel vindicated, and great strides will be made in ending the abuses the letter details. -- Thoughtful
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"Scientology has been taken over by a self-appointed dictator, David Miscavige, who has turned the Creed of the Church of Scientology, the Code of a Scientologist, and the Credo of a True Group Member on their heads and instituted the virtual practice of Reverse (Black) Dianetics..." 
Comments
Would it be possible to send some clarification in regards to sleep deprivation, and other abuses? With regards
Vera
Sounds a lot like the Extremist Muslims and Christians to me.
And why write xtians and then (christians) when you could have saved yourself the trouble and wrote it right the first time?
Christians do have confessionals. Not sure if you've heard of something called "Catholicism", their headquarters is in the Vatican. The big shot there is called "The Pope."
They, in fact, go to confession.
There was something called the reformation. Sounds like Scientology is going through a reformation of sorts now.
The cynical manipulation of celebrities was afoot then too. A professor of mine at that time told me how her son, a highly gifted graphic artist, had been recruited for Scientology's upper echelon: "He told them that he didn't believe a word of it, but the money was good. They told him that for artists at his level–belief wasn't required–so long as he didn't discuss it. So he joined Scientology."
Later, I learned through other sources that these "courses" that Scientology convinces people they need start out at hundreds of dollars and increase rapidly into the thousands and even tens of thousands of dollars. Naturally, if you take their "free personality test," you will ALWAYS need the courses. There's no percentage for them in telling you that you're OK!
Now, pause to consider, if you held the secrets to a wonderful utopian existence for everyone, why wouldn't you give them away? Why is only the test "free"?
Sir, you are terribly misinformed.
Have you not heard of 'indulgences' where the wealthy pay to have their sins after confessing them. I believe St Pauls Basillica was built on this extortion.
Its one of the main reasons Martin Luther left the RC's.
Primer on Indulgences
http://www.catholic.com/library/Primer_on_Indulgences.asp
Catholic Encyclopedea: Indulgences
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/07783a.htm
The scary thing is that Scientology management is very effective at taking ownership of what happens when good willing people get together and preys on them because of their inability to recognize that good things are happening because they are together. . .
I took a few beginning courses at the CC in LA and liked the courses but did not like the overzealous salesy staff that was hovering over every move and always looking for something wrong for me to say or do to sell me another book or course. I even had a freaky stalker that kept following me around and checking me out in my bathing suit at the purification center. This is where I drew the line. Talked to the manager of the purif center and other higher ups, who could care less about the issue, they were focused on recruiting me to join the Sea Org! As if I were to fall for THAT crap!
I wish the overzealous staff and used-car-saleaman attitude did not exist in scientology. The actual courses that I took were very helpful, just like anything handled by man gets out of hand and corrupted in some way.
Oh, by the way, the Church does NOT support nor believe in GAYS! They do not think this is possible by nature, so gays are currently not admitted in the organization.
I tend to agree with France, that Scientology does not qualify as an organized religion because it is a for-profit business.
Why won't they talk about WHAT they believe in? Other religions openly worship the center of their beliefs. Theirs is a big secret. I don't understand that. Also, what other religion charges for the study of its tenets? Sure lots of money goes to churches, but it is still free if you choose not to contribute.
They seem to be a strange triad of (1) a scientific look at life that seems to be beneficial to some people - this info is never shared because it is purchased, (2) a belief in extraterrestrials, the central leader being such, and (3) an extremely aggressive, predatory sales business.
If this is not factual, it is because this is the best I can glean from what they say and what I can read. They seem to be so secretive & untruthful, it's hard to believe what their representatives say.
It's okay to admit the truth instead of blindly defending the Church. You didn't commit the abuses. But to defend the Church's past makes you seem...well, duped.
It looks like you are one of the rare breed that hasn't lost their self respect, hats off to you! Here is an LRH quote that might help you.
“Don’t you dare lose your nerve.
“’Don’t you dare lose your nerve’ isn’t given you so much because the rest of us would be terribly disappointed in you, or because you’d probably be receiving summonses from all various parts of the country about this horrible thing which you have done to this preclear – it’s your self-respect. It doesn’t matter how many planets you blow up, or how many galaxies you collapse. It doesn’t matter a damn! Just don’t lose your self-respect.
“Before you take one inch backwards on the question of your self-respect, go through anything. Go through anything. Permit yourself to be killed, permit yourself to be dragged in the streets with wild horses, permit yourself to be put on a rack, burned alive, anything. There is nothing more painful than losing your self-respect.
“Funny. And that’s what you’re playing with when you say, ‘I haven’t got enough nerve.’ The only really vital possession which you have is your self-respect.” L. Ron Hubbard, Lecture ILLUSION PROCESSING given on November 1952
OK, Paul Haggis's letter is pretty "public", no doubt, and contains what I see to be a "disavowal". But what about just a regular public person, who decides for personal reasons to not be a church member anymore? Perhaps it's a change of spiritual leaning, nothing more vicious than wanting to move on. In most other religions you are free to do that without significant repercussions from said religion. You don't even have to make a statement, you can just disappear and after awhile folks will quit expecting to see you. The problem is with Scn, you can't do that. You HAVE to make a statement or just keep flying under the radar and lying ad infinitum. And if you DO write a polite letter to your appropriate local org terminal stating you no longer wish to be a member of the church, you think it's been great but you've moved on, and thank you for everything - WELL. You will either be subjected to attempted "handlings" and if those don't "work" (or you refuse them)you will ultimately declared SP, per the above Ethics code. Then the disconnect policy comes into force and wreaks it's usual havoc.
I don't know if this interpretation was what LRH had in mind. I really doubt it though. You should be allowed to change your religious beliefs and affiliations - it's a right we have on many levels- without being declared a Suppressive Person. I think that's the root of at least my problem these days...
On a different but related note, I can't be the only person who thinks that sending millions of tons of junk mail to people who don't want it is an overt against the 5th dynamic.
Disconnect, like breaking up, is hard to do.
Don't pardon yourself from a cult, to insult the faith of another.
That having been said, I couldn't be happier that he's free of the $cientology shackles, and I wish him the best of luck.
"However - the Bible also states that we are not to judge, that we are to love our neighbor.. and that's how most Christians live their lives. We do not "disconnect" from family or friends who are gay. We love them."
No disrespect, but this is bull, for the most part. I was raised Christian, and I can tell you right here, right now, many, MANY Christians- and members of most major religions, for that matter- that I've encountered or read about are quite judgmental, especially of gays. There have been plenty of Christians who have done just that- "disconnect" from their gay relatives or friends, or make them feel like crap for being gay. Christianity is of the biggest reasons gay marriage doesn't exist in this country, and it, along with many other major religions, is also why the country- and the world for that matter- is in such a fractious state. Do not use your compassion for others as a blanket description for all Christians.
"I'm aghast that so many can be lulled into having someone (CoS) tell them how to think, behave, and make decisions with their lives. How gullible can people be?"
Replace "CoS" with say, the Catholic church or a Jewish temple, and then ask the question again. You yourself are Christian, if I read your post correctly- how are YOU lulled into having some people wrote a book a LONG time ago and knew very little about the world, guide you on how to live your life now? It's funny when I hear Christians point the finger- the Christian churches are no better than the Church of Scientology, in my opinion.
The least judgmental people I have known or met are usually ones that question religion the most. God is great- but religions, for the most part, suck. I think they corrupt one's relationship with God and the world. Just my two cents. Kudos to Paul Haggis for standing up for his beliefs.
Regardless of whether its teachings have been helpful to any one person (or celebrity)--this is a mind-control cult. The suppressives are the people in the church who try to limit and control the actions of others. I have little doubt that the church has engaged in abuse and probably kidnapping. That the church lies is self-evident. In fact, if you'd read the church's attacks on other religions and on psychiatry, you'd have to say its personality is psychotic.
Paula claims to have made this experience. But if she isn't a billionaire and a politician, too, it can only be second-hand-experience by hear-say - and you know what outrageous stories people tell to make themselves an "interesting person".
Anyway, this can be only human flaws and singular cases. I have never experienced anything like it, and I do not know anybody who experienced it, nor have heard anything about someone claiming such things happened.
And Roman Catholics are no "oppressed" "silenced-by-fear" sheep, but they are outspoken in every way the church or the pope deserves - or seems to deserve - criticizing.
Hamster's "argument":
"Its one of the main reasons Martin Luther left the RC's."
makes me laugh: Do you know when this happened? This is a story which is much older than the United States itself.
But back to Scientology "Church":
Congratulations, Paul Haggis!
(I love your film "Crash", by the way. It is a great film about serious and sad topics, but after having watched it, you aren't depressed. On the contrary, you feel that there is hope, if each of us chooses to do the right thing whenever it comes to decision-making. - Seems you are living up to the values your film challenges us.)
Chapeau!
To disagree without spewing hatred is called tolerance. And isn't that a virtue that gay rights supporters have been purporting all along? I frankly am sick of this type of hypocrisy.
"Our Catechism based belief in the sanctity of marriage between one man and woman, has nothing to do with homophobia; it instead elevates the preservation of the foundation of society-- the nuclear family."
I was raised Catholic, and that catechism has a lot more to do with homophobia than you think. Man/woman marriages have been failing to preserve the nuclear family at an increasing rate in the country for years (the divorce rate is close to %50 now), yet no one's calling for a ban of marriage... why would you think man/man or woman/woman marriages would be any worse off? Where's the logic in it?
Now that we know all or most about these things and why/how they happen, we no longer need to attribute them to some invisible creature that demands appeasement.
"You better love me, or else I will torture you for billions of years. God"
And please are you actually saying that it's crazy to accuse the Roman Catholic Church of extortion and that priest abuse the power they have? CLEARLY you can't be serious as this is a known FACT even if what I'm talking about wasn't about money but people and mostly young boys.
So do you still think it's "CRAZY" to say that some priests may have misused their position to gain money or knowledge to gain anything financially or is that to far fetched for you?
I find it hilarious that when there is a homepage or some kind of organisation for ex-mormons, ex-scientologist and other cults.
Very often there is another "real church" responsible for it saying:"come to us, we will show you true faith, true meaning of the bible and the real Christ".
I actually find it immoral as well since most of these people are very fragile and easy to manipulate, why don't you leave them to choose if they need a faith or even want one?
Also since there is some Catholic believers here could anyone of you explain the position of the Church regarding evolution? I thought that everything in the bible was true and should be taught firmly, faithfully, and without error, has this changed and does this mean that all of the 80-90 million Catholics in the United States now believe in evolution?
Kim Jong Il couldn't have done it better.
So today, I am thrilled to not only see a new website speaking truth about this cult known as scientology, but to see so many brave people leaving this horrifically dangerous place. I have known a family utterly broken by this cult's pull and control over their son. I have seen him disappear for those same endless hours and meek paychecks. (I recall one time I was told he got a check once for seventy-five cents. Seriously.)
People, tell the truth about this cult known as the church of scientology. Sadly, like an evolving strain of a virus, it is now with us. It is unlikely to ever go away, because it will quietly and silently take victims most people will never hear about. But this good website is one place where some of those stories will now get told.
Mr. Haggis, your bravery may save lives. The loonies in scientology often think they aren't loony. Mr. Haggis, in years to come you may realize that you were conned, and that because of your sense of faith - like a blind hope that some greater benevolent force would one day manifest itself - you were taken advantage of. But the church is a predator - it takes advantage of the weak. Being weak, though, is human. We are all weak at one point. But truth and websites like this make the weak strong.
May the church of scientology go away forever, as soon as possible. May all its victims see it for what it is.
Martin Luther did leave the church because of corruption and began his own religion.
Gay is something a lot of religions do not accept. For some reason they think it is dirty or wrong. Whatever!
You could all join my religion every Sunday. It's the Order of the Holy Mattress. Anyone can join!
Yes I do have in fact better things to do. However, I am standing up for those of us who are tired of the name calling. It is wrong all around, no matter what side you take.
And I won't argue with you re: Catholicism- I was merely responding directly to a quote you made. I am not trying to change your mind, as I clearly wouldn't succeed anyway. Just know this- I have read the Catechism, and been Confirmed, and was a "proper" Catholic for quite some time before I abandoned it. The Catholic church has been wrong about so many different things- homosexuality and gay marriage included- that it amazes me it still has as many followers as it does. But you, as am I, are free to believe whatever you want. Peace be with you.
The Christian belief system is based on the teachings of Jesus who when asked "What is the greatest commandment?", replied, "Love the Lord your God with all your heart and all your soul and all your mind and all your strength; and Love your neighbor as yourself." In all his teachings he primarily talked about these two things - relationship with God and relationship with each other. If all the world adopted this belief system and treated each other thusly, we would indeed have heaven on earth.
Conversely, religion is a human institution prone to human corruption, especially the pursuit of power and control. You do not need religion or a church to follow the Christian belief system (which by the way is largely in alignment with Moses, Budha, Mohammed, Confuscious and Baha'u'llah).
I do not wish to debate religion or Christianity for that matter. My comment was about the hypocrisy of the article's author. Nuff said..
I've heard it claimed that there's no way to tell the difference between a religion and a cult, but then everybody gets tarred with the same brush. A cult is when someone comes up with a totally new scripture or interpretation from out of the blue. These may be small groups springing off Christianity or Judaism and following a charismatic, or a large group such as the Mormons. You can't deny that Joseph Smith came up with a brand new book from out of nowhere. The Koran is another example. So is Dianetics. Shunning, whatever they call it, is another indicator. Insisting that you cut ties to friends and family who don't toe the line is shunning. Amish; Jehovah's Witnesses. A third indicator is that YOU ARE DAMNED IN THE AFTERLIFE IF YOU LEAVE and none of the people in the cult will then have anything to do with you. It all fits neatly together when you consider that the cult becomes your sole human contact and if you step out of line, you're cast out without a support net. It's an effective way to keep people in line. That's why they do it.
Let's get rid of this, "Religion is only for ignorant people who need to explain thunderstorms and volcanoes." A man in hazardous quarantine was dying and there were no clergy who would take the risk to visit him. Anyway, he wasn't one of theirs. So the hospital told a minister that they knew wouldn't refuse. Although he had a family at home to think of, he dressed in protective garb and visited the man until he died. He didn't do it to convert him, but to comfort him. He accepted a duty: "Yes, I have a denomination and a church. But he had a need and that made him one of mine."
If you do away with ALL religion, you do away with concern and charity for those you don't know. You also destroy the most fertile source of ethics. One has to be raised with ethics; with the concern for others. You can't teach it in a college course.
Excuse me.
I was raised without religion, but with ethics *and* morals. I'm kind, generous, and concerned for people I don't even know. And I dare say that doing away with ALL religion may be the kindest thing we can do for humanity. It would allow people to be good for the sake of being good.
The difficulty is that we all are humans. We can easily deceive ourselves and subvert even the simplest teachings of love, kindness and respect. Our willingness to trust spiritual leaders and teachers shows our interest in becoming more spiritually aware. But it can also leave us vulnerable to manipulation. So whether it is with religions or relationships, let's step back every now and then and ask ourselves is this really what was promised? Is this practice really taking me where I want to be? Are these the "spiritual" gifts I really want? If not, move on.
It would be interesting and worthwhile to explore what they have in common that, in the lives of some believers, can inarguably produce positive results. Certainly includes community and something larger than self. Both probably biological needs which can be easily exploited and manipulated.
As far as cults, ALL of Christianity (including Catholicism, SDA, JW's, Baptists, Mormonism) is a cult: the cult of the Empty Tomb, the Cult of the Christ Myth.
I'm not an Atheist (which I've intentionally capitalized, since it pretty much has become an organized religion, what with the fervor and prostelatizing (sp?)and all...just sayin').
I was raised with no religion whatsoever, and I couldn't be more grateful to my parents. Yes, there was definitely dysfunction with my very mentally ill mother who was raised by nuns in a "Magdelene Sisters" type laundry/convent, the result of which was extreme paranoia and delusions on her part. But I'm so lucky that she decided to eschew religion, and that my scientist dad was right on board.
I don't know whether there is a God/Infinite Intelligence/Synchronicity Facillitator/Whatever or not. I've not been jaded enough to have to decide either way. Anything is possible, after all.
I do think that if there were a God, etc., they wouldn't be huge fans of any organized religion, which were created by humans to control other humans. The whole idea is simply sociopathic. But then again, maybe God, etc. is completely dispassionate, and rather bored, and is enjoying all the emotional turbulence organized religion is bringing to the fore--kinda like reality TV. (I hate reality TV, btw)
I totally understand that what we are exposed to for long periods during childhood will affect us for the rest of our lives. I was exposed to some really bizarre paranoia, and I've had over a decade of therapy to overcome that. A tad unpleasant, but never boring.
I get that people who were raised in any organized religion are going to have that kind of mindset stuck in their brains. Hence all of this argument between people of different religions.
What if you guys were to have something like support groups, as hokey as that sounds? I'd give anything to have a support group for people with mothers who believe their phone is bugged, hidden cameras are all over the house, the newscasters are reporting about them, homosexuals are trying to have sex in the basement (I wish that were a joke!), etc. Those support groups seem to be in short supply--thank God, etc. for my sister. But I'd bet a zillion dollars that there are enough folks who have been damaged by organized religion (CoS, Catholicism, Mormonism, Islam, any other hard-core "This is the only way to see things!" sects, etc.)
I've always found it very interesting that no one ever says, "F*ing Buddhists!"
Maybe they're onto something...and maybe they're not. :-)
I started a convoluted sentence in my last post, and never finished it. My bad.
"But I'd bet a zillion dollars that there are enough folks who have been damaged by organized religion (CoS, Catholicism, Mormonism, Islam, any other hard-core "This is the only way to see things!" sects, etc.)"
Incredibly poor sentence structure!!! I'm, embarassed.
The end of that "sentence", missing though it was, should read:
"..., that they could somehow find each other and tell their stories, and get some helpful support."
I don't want to toss around the term PTSD casually (I've just watched both of Clint Eastwood's films about Iwo Jima, written by Paul Haggis, which is why I'm here), but one doesn't necessarily have to have been involved in extremely violent warfare to have experienced trauma. Those guys had it worse than I could ever imagine, but I think people who have experienced less dramatic forms of trauma might feel sheepish about sharing their stories, thinking, "How ungrateful am I? I've never held my best buddy in my arms while he gasped his last breath".
I've been there (not in the trenches), you betcha'!
Would it hurt anything if you guys were to find a way to tell your religiously harmful stories to each other in some way that wasn't governed by any overseeing force? Not like an organization with the last name "anonymous", which would be a religious organization in and of itself.
Just some kind of free forum--maybe just emailing each other with a group CC thing or whatever else you might think of.
It really does help a lot to be able to converse with others who have been through something even remotely similar.
I hope this helps you guys!!!
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